A prison break map?

[Womprat]

The other day I was watching PBS of all things :eek2: and they had a nice program about POWs and their escape attempts during the war. This got me thinking about making a prison break map.

I was just wondering how possible it would be to implement. Both on the scripting side and gameplay. Now hopefully with scripting I can set it up so a certain number of allies have to make it to some specific points in the map.

On the gameplay side I'm thinking it could be difficult to balance very well. Considering varying team sizes and skills. Then there's the different classes that could make balancing tricky. Covert ops could be very important.

Then there's the story side. How do I explain the allies getting all their equipment and weapons. (kind of hard to smuggle a panzerfaust into a prison if you know what I mean!)

Anyway I just thought I'd post my thoughts and see what everyone thinks...

[Womprat]

ooh, I've got some screenshots of what I have so far. Just the basic geometry with random textures so far...
http://www.davidhogue.com/images/shot0000.jpg
http://www.davidhogue.com/images/shot0001.jpg
And an overhead view:
http://www.davidhogue.com/images/map.jpg
Green is the allies primary route. Blue is tunnel that engineers build/dyna/whatever. Light blue Xs are potential axis spawns.
This is all very rough right now so I will probably change drastically.

[BoltyBoy]

Are you contemplating using vehicles, having stealable objectives or constructable objectives? Could be a shame having a map without these since they play a large part of ET. Not that I'd want to stiffle your creativitiy.

[Womprat]

Well, I hadn't thought about vehicles yet. I wonder if I put a truck in the east courtyard and the allies just had to get it past the (buildable?) front gate and across a bridge over a moat. That would simplify the scripting a bit too.

I was planning on having a command post somewhere in there and of course a couple buildable machine gun nests. There's also the interior walls of the castle that I have no plans for yet.

[sock]

Sounds like a cool theme with guard towers to construct, mg implacements and loads of cool atmospheric buildings.

Why not make it that the allies have to break into the camp and rescue the prisoners instead. The allies could break in with a tank and then have to rescue the prisoners from a certain hut or something. Could have loads of trees and cover around the place. The allies start somewhere in the forest outside the camp.

Just ideas

Sock
:moo:

[HellToupee]

y not have a parachute with a big crate which can represent a weapons drop into the camp courtyard, the allies then have to steal a tank well there wont be one in a camp, blow sumthing up to create a exit and secure a getaway vechicle, a small forrest and airstrip might be cool, where theres a damaged plane the allies have to repair and taxi to the runway. A tunnel out of a camp sounds good to, sumthing the axis can blow up and can be repaired.

[BoltyBoy]

A plane - I like that idea HellToupee. Although runways tend to have little cover. Could be a runway cut through some trees. I think that'd make a whole map in itself, might be trying to pour too much in to one map by mixing it with Colditz.

[DACROW]

Womprat : be carefull to what textures u are using !!! looks like u are useing RTCW ones thats a no no better remove them before Id come banning ya door down LOL :eek:

[Codey]

hmmm a POW camp eh? Now there's an idea!
:banana:

[kat]

hmmm a POW camp eh? Now there's an idea!
:banana:heh..!

the camp is bound to have an armary right... one of the objectives for the prisoners could be to get that opened and becasue the objective has been done everyone gets weapons automatically (unless everyone on the team has to physically go there and pick something up - this could highten the 'stealth' aspect of using ops and then everyone getting there..!)

... or taking socks idea a step further... allies have to not only rescue prisoners but take over the compound......

[Womprat]

Well I've changed it a bit now. I think I'll use socks idea of breaking in, rescuing the prisoners, and getting out via truck or something. Once the allies get their spawn point moves to inside the castle, so they are stuck in there. This way the axis get to defend the same area, but from the front at first then from the back.
There will be an armory and a command post somewhere haven't decided where yet. And I think I'll give up the angled walls. Just too difficult to work with in the editor :( I really really like the idea of a plane, but I think that would have to go in a second or third map.
Oh, and those textures are stock rtcw, but they are only temporary as I am mapping in rtcw until the tools come out.
:banana: little banana dude says: "Thanks for all the input" :banana:

[Sacrifice]

I like the breaking out of a prison camp idea. Is it possible to have the allies start with no weapons whatsoever?

[sock]

I like the breaking out of a concentration camp idea. Is it possible to have the allies start with no weapons whatsoever?

Maps based on POW camps are borderline ok, but please dont do any concentration camp maps. They really are bad taste and will offend alot of people.

Sock
:moo:

[Cosmos]

How about make it so its based on the great escape setting?

[Sacrifice]

Sorry, bad choice of words. I didn't mean to offend anyone.

I thought POW camps in Nazi Germany were pretty much concentration camps.

[Sacrifice]

Back to my original question, is it possible to set the allies not to start with any weapons? I know a server can be set up with weapon restrictions, but is it possible to set weapons restrictions for just the one map?

[Auriel]

Sounds like a cool theme with guard towers to construct, mg implacements and loads of cool atmospheric buildings.

Why not make it that the allies have to break into the camp and rescue the prisoners instead. The allies could break in with a tank and then have to rescue the prisoners from a certain hut or something. Could have loads of trees and cover around the place. The allies start somewhere in the forest outside the camp.

Just ideas

Sock
:moo:

you mean like scientists in counterstrike?

[sock]

Back to my original question, is it possible to set the allies not to start with any weapons? I know a server can be set up with weapon restrictions, but is it possible to set weapons restrictions for just the one map?

All players start with weapons.

Sock
:moo:

[wudan]

Just get to the place, bomb a wall, escort a truck up to the place and have some kind of delay while the prisoners or loading (or you could make it so you have to go in and open up the cells, but I don't know if POW camps worked that way), and escort the truck back to the Allied rendevous point.

Sounds really good, I've been cooking some stuff too, but this sounds like a really really good map idea.

[HellToupee]

i still like my idea of the parachute and crate in the courtyard where the allies first start, have to make an exit, one heavly defended way and one sneaky tunnel way maybee with bits you have to crawl under, with getting the plane up and running, could be a small grass airstrip with a few small hangers and a ju52 in one where the allies have to repair it and escort a fuel truck to the plane and get it to taxi to the runway with the final scene of it taking off, think of the map fuel dump the first half could be the prision area with a small forest and then the grassy strip for take off, maybee with a few underground bunkers and tunnels to provide alternate paths across the strip. Could make 2 more maps 1 being the allies groups insertions behind axis lines, second where they discover somthing important (steal sum docs) then the last one where they escape.

[sock]

I've done a fair amount of research on colditz already and the place had a cool exit route already ... a glider in the roof sections of the inner courtyard.

http://www.colditz-4c.com/glider-l.jpg

You might find this page interesting as well ...

http://www.colditz-4c.com/glider.htm

Sock
:moo:

[demoneye]

Damn you Sock...

That's was my next map that is currently in development... Tell you what, someone do the ET one and I'll do a vanilla RtCW one :)

DeMoNeye

[niko]

If anyone gets any new maps done, and i REALLY RALLY LOVED the ideas in this thread alone, can you all let me know some how...msn icq or email will do


thanks

[=[mG]=Spitfire]

why not have the 1/3 of the allies team spawn(unarmed except for a knife)in the prison camp..and have the rest of the team out side around the camp.Possible ides might be that the prisoners can either wait for their comrades to come and save them or,the allies force their way out and go to a weapons storage hut or room in the coamp close by and they can try and escape by doing that.

Try and get some ides out of that POW escape map for RTCW.Make a secret tunnel leading out of the prisoners containment area

[chavo_one]

=Spitfire]why not have the 1/3 of the allies team spawn(unarmed except for a knife)in the prison camp..

All players start with weapons.

[AmazinGLarrY]

I was just wondering...

I do like the idea of getting in and blowing up a prison and escaping with allied POW's... but ahhh... I hope we're talking about "imaginary POW's" because I really doubt anybody will want to sit through a game just hanging out in a prison for 30 minutes.

Another thing is... if allies were to simply escape the prison and the Axis like won the round.... that's a crapload of allied POW's (respawning over and over, supposedly a different ally every time thus reinforcements)

So maybe the main objective for say allies is simply blowing the backdoor to the prison or something.

And I don't mean to be negative in anyway because I really really do like the idea and I want to play it as soon as it comes out! I'm just tryin to help :D

Edited: Oh wait I just thought of something that I think you may actually have said, I just read it wrong!

Ok, main objective is for allies to blow up the prison doors (after they do whatever they can to get there of course) then after the prison doors are blown their new spawn point is inside the prison and they have to escape on the truck (escort the truck to the end) and then w00h00 allies win!

Again sorry if you already said that... I just read it wrong.

[niko]

any updates?

[Codey]

Hey Womprat,
Maybe this would give you some ideas, maybe not cause it looks like yours has much different layout


POW Escape Map Page (http://wolfy.rtcwfiles.com/powescape.htm)

I can give you the source file if you are interested, PM me.

Have fun!
Codey

[Pog'S]

I'm making a mod for ET called Secret Operations together with some friends.
We too plan to make a PoW Escape map called Stalag 13d but we intend to have Allies players to be actually the prisonners of the camp.

Part 1
Obj 1 - They will have to finish up the tunnel under the compound right under the armoury. - a Covert Ops will have to steal a nazi uniform to get into the armoury via a team door. Allies will then be able to steal weapons.
Obj 2 - They will need to steal a Truck to escape.
Obj 3 - Contact Resistance via Radio in Radio Room
Obj 4 - They will have to open or blow one of the gates (main or back).


Part 2
Meet Resistance at Rendez-Vous Point in the forest to get additional ammo and weapons.
Obj 1 - Cconstruct a command post in a subterran resistance facility to allow respawn in the base.
Obj 2 - Defend the Resistance Base from Axis counter attack by constructing MG nests.
Obj 3 - Return to the camp to free the remaining prisoners and take over the Stalag. Free pows by blowing barracks doors (Covert Ops or Engineer)


Axis

Part 1
Prevent Allies from escaping by :
- Constructing Guard Towers
- Blowing the Allies tunnel to slow down reinforcement.
- Construct command post to accelerate reinforcement.

Part 2
- Destroy resistance Base by blowing their Command Post and end the game
- Protect Command Post and Barracks from Allies.

If people wants to join us, please contact me
frederick.pogu-renexter@renault.com

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-7/267917/SOBanner.jpg

[Womprat]

Well, right now the map is on hold. I'm just going to make some cheesy test maps to try out the scripting. See what is and isn't possible to do with it.
The map will need quite a bit of balancing 'cause nobody is going to want to play as a prisoner. and I don't think I can take away weapons (ammo maybe). Besides I really think the castle is just asking for a good assault mission...

Any I'll post if I happen to do anything big with it.

[niko]

if anyone is openly playtesting their maps, let me know, i can play test with the best of them :P

[Pog'S]

Well, right now the map is on hold. I'm just going to make some cheesy test maps to try out the scripting. See what is and isn't possible to do with it.
The map will need quite a bit of balancing 'cause nobody is going to want to play as a prisoner. and I don't think I can take away weapons (ammo maybe). Besides I really think the castle is just asking for a good assault mission...

Any I'll post if I happen to do anything big with it.

From what I saw players are always eager to play Allies rather than Axis, eventhough 5 maps out of 6 are more difficult for Allies. So i'm pretty sure most players would play Allies on a map where they don't have weapons at the start and must get free.

[Womprat]

From what I saw players are always eager to play Allies rather than Axis, eventhough 5 maps out of 6 are more difficult for Allies. So i'm pretty sure most players would play Allies on a map where they don't have weapons at the start and must get free.

maybe, but I don't think I can take away weapons. The most that I might be able to do would take away ammo when they spawn. However, a feild ops could fix that quickly. (note: I haven't tested removing ammo since quake3, and it was buggy then...)

[Pog'S]

Yeah that's the main problem. Maybe we could start the map at the armoury, pretending the allies have already escape from their barracks using the tunnel.
The tunnel could be considered the Allies Command Post for this map, which could be blown by axis players and reconstructed by Allies engies.

[niko]

i don't know if this is possible but....

script it so that field ops spawn some where else?

and to get out of the cell they can either wait for the spawning fieldops to show up or they can do a tower and someone can climb out and unlock the door...or like an eng blows the entrance after using a people tower to get out??

[Womprat]

well my current plan is break in to the castle (either through front door or a back entrance (or 2)), get past the first courtyard, into the second. From here allies will have to rescue the prisoners (and maybe a second obj).
Once the allies are in they spawn back in the second courtyard and have take a truck back through the first courtyard and out of the castle.
Axis will probably spawn in the first courtyard the whole time and be able to build front and side gates, and a neutral command post between courtyards.

This should solve most of the issues with removing weapons, etc. Now I've just got to figure out how to escort the prisoners to a vehicle.

I also want to fit a tunnel in there that engineers can "dig" with their pliers, but I'm not sure where or how it would help.

Anyway it's probably gonna be a while before I get around to releasing anything so just keep poking :poke: me until I get something out.

[niko]

why dig with pliars...

dynomite does wonders :)


the "tunnel" could be like 3 or 4 segments long....each with a barrier of rocks blocking it.....blow one up with dynomite...move down tunnel...blow up next barrier..

the axis could do the oppisite....planet dyno and boom...fill in tunnel

[HellToupee]

i stil stand by my idea of the plane getaway after breakout, reapir that plane and escort it to the run way u could fit it in easy, even a fuel truck could be fitted in to :) start the allies in the armoury make it look like the place took a bomb hit that let the allies get to the armoury, maybee have them have to blow up the axis barraks to destroy their spawn.

[Stomith]

you guys have a lot of imagination and I'd love to see the collective output.

The Great Escape theme. How cool?

May I add one suggestion...and it could be a bit of a quick-win for you mappers.

In the middle of one of these maps i'd love to see a no-mans land with NO towers managing them. I'd like to see shallow humps/bumps and lots of
trees/foliage. Perhaps a large wooded area. In the recent Spielberg series we saw how much of real WWII battles were up close and personal, meaning the enemy could be only feet away and you never really knew it. Dark forests and obscurred enemy sounds tactical to me. Perhaps lob a few destroyed tanks and wooden lodges in for effect. If this decreases air-strikes and increases mortar use - I'm up for it.

At the end of the day - it's the environment that makes you 'feel' the spirit of the game and I think thats why we play the damn game :)

It has to be a good way to increase your map size. I know the fps will suffer - but then, whats new. It's been like this for 10 years and the never-ending upgrading of hardware probably wont stop for some time.

Thanks for your time and don't stop your creativeness. I don't know how to 'map' so we (i) need you to keep up the fun.

Oh - and of course - I'll host it if it needs a server. I there >> #[FuN]

[Wraith2k3]

From here allies will have to rescue the prisoners (and maybe a second obj).

How about, when the prisoners where captured, the axis took an important secret document from them. So you have to rescue the prisoners and retrieve the document.

[niko]

bump

[niko]

bump again i say :banana: